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Caption: The following caption probably needs adjustments and corrections: This is a Dain City-bound train running over the CN Cayuga Sub which at the time shared the route under the Welland Canal with the CP Hamilton sub., that shiny track on the left side closest to Hwy 58A. The image is looking East from the Welland Canal. The NS operated an Intermodal Terminal at Dain City from roughly 1973 to 1998. Containers from the American west coast arrived at Dain to be unloaded and transported by road using Tallman Trucking, to Toronto. In mid-1998 the notice that the terminal was to be closed and by the end of the year it was gone. Residents of the village were pleased; the racket at the terminal had annoyed them for years. Signal bridge seen in the background alerted me this train was coming; I thought it usually ran near sundown, so this was a lucky catch. The government project to run the rail lines under the canal @ 1973 was an exceedingly expensive undertaking; unfortunately rail traffic has been on decline here ever since. The middle track has been lifted, the signal bridge redundant, and only the CP track sees any regular traffic.
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Great shot!!!!
I only caught them a couple of times there before the end. Sad it’s all history now.
i didnt realize dain city opened in 73. assume just after canal relocation was complete or did the intermodals use the old line too?
amazing the centre (shared track) only lasted 10 to 15 years before being removed from service…
also looks like the block signals in far background were approach lit!
nice catch…
Awesome shot! But would this be 146? I think 145 would have headed the opposite direction – toward Buffalo – and then continue westbound to KC (hence the odd number symbol). 145 still runs today, now only Buffalo-Decatur, with autoparts and mixed freight… no more stacks!
Thanks, guys; for comments. My replies: Greg: I am thinking because 445 was westbound, then this Dain move would be an odd numbered train as well. Mr. Host: I am puzzled by the lack of info and photos of anything Dain in the early years. I only commented 1973 because in a Hansard post by the late Peter Kormos (NDP) he spoke in defense of the Dain City locals in 1989 who had complained about the facility since it started up “16 years previous.” And to Marcus: Hey, to see this train at all is a great accomplishment. I’m glad you did !!
This is the first and only shot I’ve seen of this train, quite amazing thanks for sharing.
445 was the train number both ways.
AWM..any shots of the Dain City terminal ?
on google earth…it would loop back around…across the old canal to whats left of a wye…correct? the terminal was there?
Snake: You are correct as per the route. I do have some terminal shots but I have no idea where they are. I remember one night a long time back driving down that way and a train was just clearing the main street at Dain. That was the only time I saw a train actually in the terminal……and I know there are some slides around here somewhere. That train was harder to get than that Thorold South Forest Products switcher.:o)
AWM- I know you can come through with the terminal shots…..I’ll even re-instate your berm priviliges if you do
Awesome picture Arnold!
Greg Smith is right. This would have been train 146 which operated from KC to St. Thomas. 145 went the other way from St. Thomas to KC. They were symbols this way for the reasons Greg stated, which is the same reason that many CN and CP freights in the Niagara region are numbered against convential wisdom. (ie westbound odd/eastbound even)
When I got my first scanner in 1992 I would often leave it on all night. The only thing I could pick up were the Caledonia and Jarvis towers anyways. Each night would be interesting as 145 made its way out of St. Thomas the CN NI/DS RTC would try and figure out where he would meet the two trains. Often they would meet at Moulton. These trains would report there lifts and set outs to the RTC that they had performed at Feeder. (The very yard Trillium now uses to interchange traffic with CN) CN switch the rain city intermodal yard and would haul the intermodal over to Feeder for 145 to lift and pickup intermodal from 146. Often 145/146 would be van hops between Feeder and St. Thomas but they would also handle traffic that may have missed the 327/328 connections as those trains ran between St. Thomas and Buffalo Jct Yard in Buffalo on days.
After 145/146 were cut off between Buffalo and St. Thomas (just before the Cayuga Sub was mostly abandoned from Mile 22 to just east of Delhi with the exception of the Nelles Road-Jarvis stretch which lived 1 more year), NS began running train 445 as a turn between Dain City and Buffalo Jct to transport the stacks from Dain City. These would still be St. Thomas crews but they would get to Dain City via taxi. Train 406 was the NS freight interchange train at this point running between Buffalo Jct and CN’s Niagara Falls yard via Fort Erie. This would later become 369, H3R and now H53!
PRH
I just hit send without spell checking! Sorry everyone! That’s Dain City and Nelles Corner, not rain city and Nelles Road. Good lord.
PRH
Thank you for the compliment, Mr. H., and that great run-down on what is what around Dain. It was just one of those places we seemed to ignore over the years………..and GLS to be thanked here as well………he kept notes on everything, and I mean everything….so #146 it is.
Incredible stories, everyone.
PRH Curious why did the Cayuga to Jarvis survive one more year than the rest? Thank you again for the great information.
Steve:
There was a customer at Nelles Corners who put up a pretty good fight to keep his rail service. The CTA ordered CN to service him from the Hagersville Sub for one year past the order date for the rest of the line. True to form, CN ordered an extra “B559″ every Sunday to run from Brantford to Nelles Corners via Garnet to do this customer only!
See here if you want more info:
https://otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/ruling/870-r-1995
Awesome shot.
I’ve read that report regarding the objections to the abandonment of the Cayuga in the past. One has to wonder if that stretch of the Cayuga to Nelles Corners may have survived if CN decided to lease the Hagersville out to a shortline sooner. For those who may not know, Armstrong still receives hopper loads which are transloaded at the elevator in Hagersville.
James, the regulatory framework for shortlines simply did not exist in the timeframe you speak of. The act came into effect in 1996 and the shortlines came as fast as railways could give them out, it takes time to work out deals, 1997, 1998 and 1999 were prolific times for Shortlines. Prior to that, it was a hot mess.
The Central Western (1986 – Tom Payne) and GEXR (1992 – Railtex) were major efforts, test beds if you will, starting a shortline was a giantic effort back then, and took a lot of government intervention and a boatload of work on the part of the pioneers of the industry and government to see them through. Plus change in government delayed it all by a few years due to labour laws.. (Documented in Thorning/Hooton Rails to Goderich book)
But some of the Shortline pioneers, including OSR’s Jeff Willsie and even Trillium’s Wayne Ettinger – which were not granted shortlines until AFTER the act – were pushing for the deregulated framework prior to enactment in 1996 (and forming their own Shortlines by means of acts of parliament!). Witness that Trillium’s parent company is ultimately called the “Caledonia and Hamilton Southern Railway” – do you want to bet what Wayne was looking to capture when he formed it in 1994? Probably the very line you speak of and/or the Hagersville!
Then the explosion of shortlines occurred.. and brings us to today – where 21 years later, as these leases expire, we’re seeing churn as agreements are re-negotiated, cancelled, or changed to new operators.
There’s also major politics involved – CN wanted to shed lines, but also you can bet their dollar they wanted to shed NS too. Just took much longer than they thought… NS’s iron clad agreement at least forced CN to give them another route.. you’ll never see agreements like that again!
But ultimately, look at the new elevators on GEXR/CN in Breslau, Shakespeare, and on the Goderich sub – this is business that was once north on the Branches now moved south. Takes a while but it will move to rail eventually, CN knows this… just takes 10 to 20 years..
More recently, the CASO abandonment of 10 miles from Fargo to Ridgetown – which should have been kept – the place was shipping 20 cars a week (From St. Thomas 40 miles away), instead could have been done for 10 miles ex Fargo witch would likely still be profitable, but they ripped ‘er up. Would have made more sense to keep that and do Blenheim along with it, but the timing didn’t work out as CSX still owned some of the track needed to make it work out. Wonder where South West AG is shipping to now. There’s dozens of these ag customers now without direct rail, but most were very infrequent. Ridgetown was one of the more frequent at the time (2005).
Feel free to discuss/negate/add – just my two cents
Mr. Host, all this rail information you and some others post should be condensed into a separate “Railfan Primer” section on RP so that all of us could access it rather than just the few that receive responses regarding this photo. Many members of RP have never known what you just posted, and guys like me tend to forget what we did know………….
Arnold, it would take a book and even then, i’m no expert – just taken some of this in over some 17 years..
I met a kid today, when I mentioned who Greg McDonnell was didn’t know who he was… I asked – don’t you buy books? Nope. I don’t – he said.
My god. These kids have no idea of what happened prior to the Internet basically..
Who is ….Stephen “C” Host….?
Snake: Steel Steve.